Interviewee was the Deputy CJ2 (length of assignment unknown).
Interviewee provided that he/she was made aware of the following incidents: a detainee was walked back to his cell in the nude. The interviewee stated that he/she learned of the detainee death around late October, he/she learned of a detainee dying in the shower area, face down, handcuffed with hands to his back; the body was placed into a body bag with ice.
The interviewee also recalled learning from International Committee of Red Cross (ICRC) that detainees were wearing women's underwear.
Also stated that dogs were used to sweep the cells to search for weapons.
SWORN STATEMENT
For use of Itis Wit , AR 19045: the Pc0POnant WHIN is ODCSOPS
PRIVACY ACT STATEMENT
(SW).
This 10 USC Section 301; Tisa 5 USC Section 2951: E.O. 9397 dated November 22. 1943
AUTHORITY:
To provIds commanders and law enforcement officials with means tiy which information may be accurauly sten6640.PRINCIPAL
Your social sectally number Is Imo as an additioneliallamMe means of identificabon to facilitate Sing and retrieval.ROUTINE USES: Disclosure of your social security human is limitary.
DISCI,OSURE .
4. FILE NUMBER
12. DATE (fYYYMAIDD) 3. TIME
1. LOCATION
2004105/
I
7. GRADE/STATUS
6. SSN
LAST NAME, FIRST NAME, MIDDLE NAME
05
••' el 1 • .1 • OR ADDRESS
, WANT TO MAKE THE FOLLOWING STATE/ABB' UNDER OATH:
and MG
I volunteered to deplo to CITF-7 ith duties as the Deputy C.12. When 1 arrived, some of the arganizatio in charge of the Intelligence Fusion Cell. On 13 Sep Inset told Me
FAST was the C2 and
was. I
t the Joint Interrogation Debriefing Center at Abu Oka. I did not Mow what
that he did needed some assns m Marge of the ADC and COL PAPPAS was the commander. I was told 'would be AIM' awas told that 205th Ma BDE was
Liaison Role. My responsibilities were to get the reporttng done, establish target folders and set the flow of intelligence to the Ci
with civilian and soilitarypersoonel operate!. I was not told of the role of
started. I was told the IIDC was a purely Army Other Government Agencies (OGA.). ted that the 205th Ml BDE had responsibility of all the MI units at Abu Ghraib. He stated that other smaller going to be shut down and everyone was pm to be wicsrpet
facility and it would be Abu Ghraib. My understanding was that I was the Liaison for BO Feet toast 203th. I
Sud art Forrn and I wrote mine based on his and my Lamson dunes.
1 Fermi° C2
'
it.: My duty deseeiplim on Form was Liaison officer or Senior Liaison Officer. The day after I introduced me to CXIL PAPPAS (I September 2003). I told COL PAPPAS that I was not HUMINT BASE and had
I never received my Support Form back so 1 do not know
with HUMINT operations. On 16 September. COL PAPPAS took me to Abu Gbraib. He introduced me
He told him / wu there to =wort with reporting and developing target folders and to check to sec if there was a place for me. the operations officer and the senior Ml officer on the ground. I stayed at Abu Ghraib and COL PAPPAS that same tight. He left due to the threat on the roads. He had other laces in Bilad and Camp Victory He was all over the sitars bewtx his ttni s. After COL PAPPAS left and elped me get situated He showed me the living a statement t to the officer from =F." we heard about. I heard you were coming to aunt in told him I was
there to he get operations up and running, the reporting started and develop target folders so that the flow of intelligence can get to C2 ok me around and showed me the arca. I found out thert were other MI twits there. B/325th MI, A151 . an P CO
.
y Smut 323rd MI. 1 visited the doting facilt , Camp Vigilant, Camp Gauci, the isolatem area in the Hard Sac. The MP TOC and was introduced in charge of the Interrogation Control Element. The first night I was there, 16 September, ge or me to 1 In on an intearogatitm. The interrogation was held in Tier IA (hard site). This was the Ml Area where High Value Detainees where held. MI did not rim it. The MPs did. MI did nos have flee access to get in. Before the uneirogation, 1 met the team to the "MC. The senior interrogator told me to just observe. He said be was going to use the fear up and was going to be very aggressive We were givers access by the MPs. The anteM3gition hutted an hour am a half. I didn't ace any detainee abuse. The interrogator was calm and didn't really raise his voice. The interrogator s em to tuive Ian to follow . (1 used this to help develop the interrogation plan). Based on the interrogation! observed,1 told
t we needed to develop target folders and come up with a diagram of who should be dosis what I also
COL PAPPAS on some ideas I had on target folders Prior to my first interrogation. I did not get the linerroption Rules of Engagement. Within days of my arrival, I read and sign the D(OEs. I don't quite remember when but I know it was before the mortar attack (20 September 04). 1 believe the Ilt were on a message format sent by LTG Sanchez. COL PAPPAS tame back to Abu Ghraib and he and 1 along wi d an expanded discussion of my role. I told him that there was no SOP to nu" the operations and that I could he him out by s g to wine one and making it happen. He chastised me. He said that the SOP was the bngade's responsibility and that they were already working on one. He told mc, "Hers is what I want you to do." He wanted me to work on ideas on developing target folders to help locus the interrogators. Once Target Fold= are complete, work on an interrogation Ian and then structure on a reporting format approved by M. He was only on site for about two hours. After be left, continued to introduce me to CACI personnel. the 321st MPs, the Engineers, the Chaplain. Al that time, I bell barge of the MI operan e MPs were us charge of their operazioniSMINIkimme I was introducod to 20th MP BN CDR. gave me a run down on what the MP Company's missions were. e stated that the MI folks were focus on Camp Vigilant. He told me the number MPs and Detainees on the ground and 'bent the
1s
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TAKEN AT DATED
STATEMENT OF
a. STATEMENT (Congnuad/„„
' Bed me med ia tha we might have Site. He salted if I way to the LSA saideMMI:9
was) I went assist. I asked who themind going in to assist them. (I didn't really know and I was trying to &sd nut who thedetainee was and the MPs were sorting this thing out y were suiting up far a cell
suspected detaineafwere. I knew there had been a threat of one of them vying to kill some one. I found out one of the =specs was at the far end of the hallway. I told them where to stand and leading them. I told them to be careful because they might be hiding the
Than were shalt fired (MPs had rubber bullets).
weapon. Next thing I knew. someone stepped up and around came flying out.
Someone finally used a mirror to show where the detainee was in the all and he was shot in the leg. The detainee was later medivac
out and return at a later time. I questioned that decision. I saw myself as the Wider since I was the ranking officer. In hindsight. I
believe maybe my actions were not the best decisions. I notified COL PAPPAS and relayed to him what had occurred. I am not sure
used to swap thewhen he was notified. COL PAPPAS requested that the facility be locked down. The QRF came in
brought them in.
facility. In reference to Ghost detainees, OGA would bring in detainees for a short periodatm. These particular ghost detainees were not yet eategonzed and OGA was working on that. It was very diff; keeping track of these OGA bet auag they w t processed until OGA decided to turn than over to us. COL PAPPAS was not happy with that procedure. in:emended that a Memorandum of Under& be wntten up between OGA and MI on the procedures to o a ghost detainee. COL PAPPAS met with OGA and -121 and the niemoranclum on dropping ghost detainees was ' COL PAPPAS introduced a couple of more guys fretta
rimilteAle lkassist with possible linguist and logistics.
_. . . had heard of me froLt!Buys accompanied his oe about twice a week. I never knew of bin intenopting. I
aiaIlLi=call briefing MG FAST or Some of the incidents of detainee abuse I was aware of are as follows: It was brought to my attention b were walking back a naked detainee from the tote:rogation COL PAPPAideat. He
illinirillYst'an ..0e L.
—
PAPPAS of the event. He told me to et explain to thane= seriousness of this. I
their NCOIC and explained the aerie of incident. I told them it was wrong Z OW I s . ted she didn't think it was • he had tile she was strapping down deamee, but :ha ' it was . I didn't fo=panelt,
any disciplinary Dean taken. I did not have any more conversations with COL PAPPAS reference this
me if I bad recommended UCM.I. I told her u wasn't in my lane. In reference to the death of a detainee around late
sober, this is what 1 remember. I was asked if I knew where COL PAPPAS was and I told them be was in a meeting. I was then told that someone, jiad died 111 the Hard Sate. I asked dif it was military and they said no that it was a detainee. I walked over so the ... cell and saw alai] doctor on site. He told me that the detainee was dead. The detainee was facing down, handcuffed withhis hands to his and the shower stall. The handed ., s were mama off and be was turned over. Hooked around for blood to if. there had been any beating and didn't find •. I asked the MPs if tray had notified the battalion and the OGA oink said be woul notify his su rvuo notified COL PAPPAS andsaid he Wilt his way and to keep him alizeuteverything. Hard Sue OIC came in and therea 'iced. id he had to go to W, ' and could We ease take care o the body. I told him we dicit'.1 have e facilities to care of a dead body. Meanw •
aught in a body hag and we began looking for ice loud off the shower area to keep pee* fromgoing in there. A liner was brought 111 and the bodytaken outmaking it appear as if we were taking someone sick out 'CID was informed and the body was taken to get an autopsy w accompanied the body. OGA had apparently brought the•etainee at around 0530. Seal Team 7 had captured the individual during one of thou missions. The detainee was presumed to have been involved in the attack against the ICRC. The detainee apparently had several weapons with has He was resisting wrest andapparently the Seal Team but stroked him on the side of the head I never saw e results of the investigation CID conducted. I waster the report on the news came out. to speak to a case officer, ho was investigating the incident. I believe
ter
an attorney. In reference to clothing for dearness. I know -Mere was a problem with getting jumpsuits. When I arrived at Ghraib. some detainees had minium:nuns. It Sauptember, it was very warm and detainees would take their top off, hut theyalways had clothes on. 1 never saw any detainees without any clothing except for when they arrived and were being searched and a few who had mental problems would tear their clothes off. I never saw any detainees with women underwear on or on their beads.The only time I was aware of detainees with women underwear was wilco the ICRC mentioned that detainees were wearing women'sunderwear. I have no knowledge or ever saw any cletamee being thrown off the back of a truck. I have no knowledge of dogs everbang used or approved for mtenogations. Dogs were used to sweep the cells after the shooting to ensure no weapons were on site. I
do not know if COL PAPP caved 'move] to c night of the shooting. I otos in which Iidentified on sev guist. Fossil) ntarogator, Analyst. and on onephoto Possibly s were taken in e isolauon sue and depicted detainees naked and 1 bunched gether. Ialso identified a female TITAN Linguist on three other photos. one to. red
to be to errogaungoalkire. who was si ' chair facmg back in a stressed posmo standing by the The
other photos were and %ether.
Q. Do you have an else to add to stammer .
A. No
111111111110111/111111111111111/1111111111111111111111111EndofStatementfill111111111111/1111111/11111/1110/1
INITIALS OF PERSON MAKING STATEMENT
PAGE 3 OF 4 PAGES
PACE 2. DA FORM 2821 DEC 1998 IJIMPAVIA0
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use THIS PAGE IF NEEDED. IF MS PAGE IS NOT NEEDED, PLEASE PNOCS® TO FINAL PARE OF TINS FOAM. DATED 2004/051
9. STATEMENT (Conti44 MPs and MI
with MI or detainees. Theattacks and IEDs. lie
frequent I wet asked by
not have an X0 and I met his 53
od one =dim:des:jowl one.
was a good is those mean. All
MPs and so I became the MIattend the mmtOg briefings held
attended the meetioo. I interacted with everyone io that meeting. The topes discussed was basically logistical
units at I. doing
issues; DFAC, showers; weight room. By the first week I was =proving the process and getting into operations.third visit, after 1 arrived, be told me I had 3I0 command and control nor did
what suppose . my
the operations officer and I was from another unit. By 10-12 Oct, I hade said
Within 2-3 days of my anal, I
receivedany FRAGOs or OPORDS from C117-7
roles andresponsli
them all on his computes.. The only problem was that there was only one computerbegan to read them.
available for use. The essence a w at mid or reviewed were the MOE, Force Protection issues, Convoy FRAGM, focus of Intelligence c.stimate. I had also noticed it was not a smooth operation and I wanted to pull the disputed poops Meeting, but COL PAPPAS basically told me to stay in my lane. Between the 1st and 2nd week, I spoke to COL PAPPAS shoot hew po one was really in charge. He told me be was in charge but be wanted me to bathe JIDC rnroaadea.I told hiniI would think sheik it This
rrwhat COL PAPPAS had offered toe. I asked COL our or five days after the mortar attack. I spoke
COL PAPPAS would have input on my OFR and be said no. A about a week, got back with COL PAPPAS and
soldiers. He said no and I replied with 1 don't think that would work' and., .. o if I would have C itlIMMIIIM He said that tow
came in the JIDC looking f
declined it On 5or 6 October
interrogators along with a translator (of Egyptian nationality) were under the influence alcohol, WIT gone in to get a detainee to
interrogate. They went in on their own and the MPs allowed them to go IL No hnecrogations wine supposed to occur at night
because of the mortar attacks that were occurring in the evenings and our intat ogstious was sometimes held onside in tents. The
interrogators took a female detainee and asked her to remove her top and kissed bar. The same day I was made aware of this
occurred. He asked me to read them their sights and handle theincident I phoned COL PAPPAS and relayed to him w assistance. I got a copy of the opts statement and read each oneArticle 32. I checked with the magistrate all, Commander was also meant. Ali three invoked their rights and
of them their rights and the article 32. Their I and o
the JAG officer. I told h&t what I knew. I believe CID also receivedrequested an attorney. The statements were taken to
Theinterroption eonacaded with the
a copy of the statements. To my recollection, the investiganon was =founded. Amr --ly.
interrogation Ian and there were charges. The Linguist was bandai. to another location. The day following this
went over the Interrogation Rules of Engag eat I adhoc formetioo and told
incident,
them that I was I wanted to make sure everyone knew the IROEs. I to mike are Was was
additional trunin,g. No one objected to me calling the formation because I was pretty • COL P AS told Owl&
tad put that out COL PAPPAS wanted optimism: to nm 24/7 but I did not agree and be told me to stay in my hum
did not want to do 24/7 operations and I told her that if she had someone conduct one interrogation early in the morning it Would
meet the BDE CDR's requirements. There was a problem with not enough equipment to conduct the mission. Units were showing',
wan personnel but no equipment, office equi pment or even personal equipment. On one instance, I sent back CAC oontramors
because they. did not have TA-50. I search for crew :mod weapons, computers, and medical applies. I brought this up to COL
• PAPPAS. His staff then told me not to to to the Cdr on these issues to bring them up to dm= I started working with them but nothing was being none. After three weeks I stopped working with the staff because there was limited *movement MG Fast came oy Abu Glsraib in Mid October. She asked me to tell her bow things were really going. I told her we needed combat lifesaver bags etc., She said I needed to help with Mayoral type of dunes. Within two day of speaking to MG F , en received radios, computers and other critical equipment. Plus we had JWICS. By mid October, COL P AS all Mayoral duties in iiupport of interrogations with a duty description based on GTMO. I agreed and then spoke bout what bad nappmed. I wanted to go to MG FAST. He advised me to have all my ducks m order if I did. also to be agreed with my
new dunes and told me to go take cam of soldiers. 1 never notified BG FAST of the changes to my duties. I didn't think it was
appropriate for me to tell her that. This all occurred at the same time COL PAPPAS moved to Abu Ghoul. My duties were
papally soldier care, maintenance, billeting, awards, and assistance with administrative support of the JIDC. I will provide • copy
of my duty desertion= The MPs were still in charge of Abu Glint-la and ran their meetinp. I met with the MPs twice a day and
never saw or became aware of any abuse or heard of any rumors of mistreatment, never saw or was aware of any piconsts or videos of
detainee abuse and I never saw any dogs being used during unerrogatusas. 1 never was aware of MI telling the MPs to "soil= up' or
give "the treatment" to detainees. During my daily meetings no one mentioned any such things. I didn't see anything that appeared
the MPs were lacking oversight. Than was a good feeling among the MPs. They were focused and were very profeationaL I simply
believed they needed more MPs to assist • ion. I never went to the MPs LSA. Within days of the Memorial, LTG
Sanchez went to visit Abu Ghost. ed me to help him put Beate slides together and COL PAPPAS asked use
to bnef. Mortars were constantly us but I don't ow why than wasn't more aggressive panelling or preplanned !bet. COL
PAPPAS brought in the 165th MI BN and the 82nd sent additional assets to assist with the Force Protection mission. COL PAPPAS
spoke to BO KIRPINSK1 but I don't know what the result of the meeting was. The International Red Cross visited Abu Glnalb and
their report stated there were allegations of detainee abuse such as detainees wearing female underwear on their heads,
electrocutions, and physical abuse. COL. PAPPAS asked me if I had seen my of this and I said no. I am not aware of COL PAPPAS
doing anything about it This occurred mid to late October. A month Isar, JAG began to respond to the ICRC allegations. This was
all news to me because prior to the ICRC, I bad no idea this was going on. On 24 November, I was on my
INITIALS OF . PERSON MAKING STA4EMENT
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TAKEN AT
STATEMENT OF
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NOTHING FOLLOWS
.1.¦¦¦•¦¦•1,
AFFIDAVIT
HAVE READ OR HAVE HAD READ TO ME THIS STATEMENT
WHICH BEGINS ON PAGE 1, AND ENDS ON PAGE 4 I FULLY UNDERSTAND THE CONTENTS OF THE ENTIRE STATEMENT MADE
THE STATEMENT IS TRUE. I HAVE INITIALED ALL CORRECTIONS AND HAVE INITIALED THE BOTTOM OF EACH PAGE
BY ME
CONTAINING THE STATEMENT. I HAVE MADE THIS STATEMENT FREELY WITHOUT HOPE OF BENEFIT OR REWARD, WITHOUT
THREAT OF PUNISHMENT, AND WITHOUT COERCION, UNLAWFUL INFLUENCE. OR UNLAWFUL INDUCEMENT.
(Signature of Person Making Statement)
Subscribed and sworn to before me, a person authorized by law to
WITNESSES
MAY 2004
administer oaths, this day of
at
(Signature of Person Administering Oath)
ORGANIZATION OR ADDRESS.
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ORGANIZATION OR ADDRESS.
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